Talk:The Facts in the Case of M. Valdemar

Novels: Short story / 19th century Mid‑importance

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Odd sentence[edit]

"In between trance and wakefulness, Valdemar tongue begs to quickly either put him back to sleep him."

I'd edit this if I knew what the last part (of the either/or) is supposed to be, but I haven't read the story. Tales 12:59, 2 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for catching that! It's certainly an odd plot element but I think I fixed it so it makes more sense grammatically. Plot-wise, it's odd because it's the tongue that is talking, rather than Valdemar himself. Does it look any better this way? --Midnightdreary 13:16, 2 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I looked over the text of the short story itself and found that your alterations are perfectly compatible. Where did the weird grammar come from in the first place? Frotz (talk) 04:49, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Afraid all of you are misinterpreting the text entirely too literally. Poe is making a distinction between normal speech (which appears to emanate from the lips of the speaker) and the unnatural speech of Valdemar, which seems to emanate from the throat and "lolling tongue" while the lips and jaw do not move. He is not saying that the tongue itself can speak, or that it has a mouth or a separate existence or mindfulness from Valdemar himself. I am editing the article to improve accuracy. 12.233.146.130 (talk) 20:35, 21 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Who is M. Valdemar[edit]

The man's name in the story is Ernest Valdemar. But who is M. Valdemar in the title? Is it an archaic version of Mr.(mister)?--87.184.136.234 (talk) 09:50, 10 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It's a common abbreviation for "Monsieur". --Midnightdreary (talk) 14:40, 10 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much. So the story takes place in France (or Canada or anyplace with Monsieurs)? I think it's not mentioned in the article. I have read the story a few decades ago, so I am not even sure. If it's France maybe it should be added.--87.184.136.234 (talk) 15:21, 10 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

No, there is no indication of where the story takes place. --Midnightdreary (talk) 17:32, 10 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Any relationship to... Voldemort?[edit]

I'm just curious if anyone has rooted out any correlation of 'Valdemar' and J. K. Rowling's Lord Voldemort. There aren't any references connecting both (they may just merely sound similar to a non-native English speaker!), but Rowling's Voldemort is terribly afraid of death, and most of his motivation in the books is related to this fear of death (and, ultimately, his demise).

I read Poe's story many years before Rowling wrote her first book in the Harry Potter series, so I didn't make the connection until I came across this wiki page today (by pure coincidence)!

— Gwyneth Llewelyn (talk) 15:19, 13 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Without a reliable source, this is speculative and falls under original research. Therefore, it does not qualify for inclusion in this article. --Midnightdreary (talk) 15:58, 13 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Valdemar is not Spanish[edit]

It's a mystery why Meyers claims that that Valdemar is Spanish and means "Valley of the Sea", but it wouldn't be the first time an otherwise reliable source got a detail wrong. We have no obligation to include every minor detail from a source, especially not when a statement is demonstrably based on false assumptions.

The only reason to include an interpretation like that of Meyer's[1] is if there is a source that confirms that Poe himself believed that "Valdemar" was of Spanish origin and meant "Valley of the Sea". Peter ^Isotalo 20:36, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Whether you or I agree or not, a quick search on Google Books finds three additional sources that agree with this reading: Here and here and here. I was curious if we could add sourced material that aligns with Waldemar, as noted in your edit summary. Or is that an assumption or original research? Other readings would certainly help make the article more robust and, to your point, perhaps water down something that might be questionable. --Midnightdreary (talk) 20:43, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think what Stadler (2001) explains seems more relevant since it focuses on literary analysis, not the actual etymology of the name "Valdemar". If you focus the article text on the analysis, I believe it'll make a lot more sense. Peter ^Isotalo 10:03, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ooh, I like this. Any expansion of analysis is a good thing anyway. I'll see what I can do, though you might be better suited than me. --Midnightdreary (talk) 12:03, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tried to add some. I'm more into language than literature so I don't know if I summarized Stadler properly. Peter ^Isotalo 16:11, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]